Topic: Is having a Bible in the classroom a Mount Vernon Teacher's right?

[Forest]

SDB,

I can respect your beliefs.

Church and State speaks differently.

Maybe he would be better suited as a pastor.

[Forest]

Ma'am

I don't subscribe to your beliefs, as you know

HOWEVER, when people start dictating what others read....or what books one can have on their desk in a workplace, we have a BIG problem.

Unless there is a rule or regulation that states that one cannot have a Bible on one's desk at school, the school is waaaaaaaaay outta line on this one................

They are absolutely not dictating what someone can read.  They are dictating what someone CAN'T teach.

curious mind
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     Re: Culture & Moral Law
« Reply #33 on: September 13, 2007, 09:24:49 AM » Quote 

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Society breaks down dear Forest when some try to force their religious philosophies on others, and those 'others' don't appreciate it.   Those who believe that their own religion should take precedence over others' 'common sense' are what 'warp' society..........not those who believe that all people's have a right to take history, and life events, into consideration when making decisions, sans religious philosophies they don't believe in.

I admit that religious philosophies have always had a hand in developing cultures, only because there are those humans who don't 'trust' their own inate abilities to make sound decisions, and must search for supernatural forces to 'help' them.  Sad.

Sorry, couldn't resist. 

oh hell, I just dug this out of the archives.  You can't make this spinning up, I swear to....uhhh, I swear to......uhhh,

I SWEAR!

[Steve.Deserved.Better]

Ma'am

I don't subscribe to your beliefs, as you know

HOWEVER, when people start dictating what others read....or what books one can have on their desk in a workplace, we have a BIG problem.

Unless there is a rule or regulation that states that one cannot have a Bible on one's desk at school, the school is waaaaaaaaay outta line on this one................

I know, CM, that you don't and I respect your beliefs as well.    A book on a desk = What?  Opinions vary.  Harmless, dictorial or preaching?  

I wonder though, with this new distraction, if they thought that the citizens couldn't handle both wrongs.   It is, in my opinion, yet another example of where the school board are putting their priorities.   With the advent of the breakdown of education and the constant need for more money and teacher's taking heat on everything imaginable, you would think someone, somewhere would be smart enough to sit down and figure out how to fix this instead of protecting their arses.  But it is no surprise, really, it happens in every venue, not the first time and won't be the last.  What would be a surprise, if someone would actually have a solution and be strong enough to fix it.

[Booyah]

Booya, believers don't believe that to be correct.  As a follower of Jesus, believers are to be ambassadors for Him.  That is not to say to shove it down some one's throat, but to be examples so that your life is a reflection of what it is to be a believer.  However, and it is sad to say, as a believer myself, we all fall short of this goal and it really dirties up the picture.  Being a believer, doesn't mean to be perfect, it just means that as a sinner, to be forgiven and you are relying on the death, burial and resurrection of Christ to save you.  That is Grace.  But to hide it, would be an admission that my faith isn't there.  I hope nothing I say here is construed to shove it down any one's throat, or a judgement, just an attempt to put myself out there for what I believe in.  AND hopefully not to be ridiculed for my beliefs. 

OHHHHH..so you speak for all believers?  I believe in God and His son Jesus Christ and, believe me, you do not speak for me.  Anyone who penned a passage in the bible is looong gone.  So, now it is up to interpretation. 

Just as I said, religion tears people apart.  Here you prove it by telling me what believers believe and what they should do.  Amazing.

[SeaBreeze]

Ma'am

I don't subscribe to your beliefs, as you know

HOWEVER, when people start dictating what others read....or what books one can have on their desk in a workplace, we have a BIG problem.

Unless there is a rule or regulation that states that one cannot have a Bible on one's desk at school, the school is waaaaaaaaay outta line on this one................

They are absolutely not dictating what someone can read.  They are dictating what someone CAN'T teach.

curious mind
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     Re: Culture & Moral Law
« Reply #33 on: September 13, 2007, 09:24:49 AM » Quote 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Society breaks down dear Forest when some try to force their religious philosophies on others, and those 'others' don't appreciate it.   Those who believe that their own religion should take precedence over others' 'common sense' are what 'warp' society..........not those who believe that all people's have a right to take history, and life events, into consideration when making decisions, sans religious philosophies they don't believe in.

I admit that religious philosophies have always had a hand in developing cultures, only because there are those humans who don't 'trust' their own inate abilities to make sound decisions, and must search for supernatural forces to 'help' them.  Sad.

Sorry, couldn't resist. 

oh hell, I just dug this out of the archives.  You can't make this spinning up, I swear to....uhhh, I swear to......uhhh,

I SWEAR!

I didn't know that having an object on a desk constituted "teaching".

[helly5647]

Jason, I totally agree with your first post.  My daughters made the same points  last night about this.  The oldest also said  " If you aren't standing up for God, then who are you standing up for?"

I think too, that the kid that started all this could have gotten in some kind of trouble in class, and decided to make a stink just to get even. 

[sammy]

They are absolutely not dictating what someone can read.  They are dictating what someone CAN'T teach.

But, as I am understanding, the teacher in question WASN'T teaching from his Bible, it was just laying on his desk. And, from reading posts on other forums, it seems that Bible has been laying there for quite a few years, Others that now have children in school remember the Bible being on his desk when they were in school and the say he never once tried to teach religion to them in his classroom.

Another point, if the school does not have a policy that says the Bible cannot be displayed on a teachers desk, then this whole controversy is a mute point. IMHO
[/quote]

[curious mind]

Hey "sis"

Freshwater wasn't pushing his beliefs on ANYONE - he has a doggone BOOK on his desk

geez

[SeaBreeze]

Maybe the Bible is a source of inspiration for Mr. Freshwater.  Would it be more appropriate for him to have a statue of Jesus, or a Buddha statue on his desk?

[sloppyjo]

I just think this is nuts.  Lets say he takes the book to school to read on his lunch.  Lets say a woman teacher does the same and puts it in her bag of school papers and a student notices it in her bag and complains?  He is a man with no purse and has a bible so what.  How many students carry ALL sorts of things to school they are not allowed.  There is NO law or rule saying he can not have in his possession a bible.  He was not quoting scripture.

[curious mind]

SeaBreeze - he should be able to have EITHER, should he wish

[sloppyjo]

Should ALL students and teachers remove thier necklaces with a cross on them.  I know I wore one 90% of my school career.

[SeaBreeze]

Had it been announced in advance that there was going to be a rally on the square, I am sure more people would have turned out.

Also, I still do not understand WHY it is part of the curriculum to teach the history of Religion in Social Studies at MVMS, with a unit on each religion, yet Mr. Freshwater is not allowed to have a Bible sitting on his desk that he is not teaching from.

CM, yes, I believe he should be able to have what he wants on his desk also.

[sammy]

NBC4I.com has a survey on whether Mr Freshwater should be made to remove his Bible from his desk. So far the no's are way ahead of the yeses.

[stockader]

Does anyone know what Jesus looked like.   I could have a bobble head of Jim Tressel on my desk to represent a statue of Jesus.  As long as I believe it we would have to outlaw Jim Tressel from our schools.